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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 3, 2006 15:10:13 GMT
Wow that was a good rant, now here's mine.....
Religion is a bunch of codswallop and people shouldnt be pressured into believing all from one religion like you said, but I believe parts of it is real. It must be. There are somethings most religions believe. Like hell and the devil. Or Heaven and God.
These are my thoughts on the afterlife. When you die you die. Thats it, end of. Thats eternal rest for ya. But if you've lead a life of hate and pure evil (really evil), then you're inner worm gets dragged into the earth. Till it reaches hell. And that my friends, is the core.
No human has ever made it to even the edge of the fire. It is too far from the surface. But at the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean the mantle is much nearer. And a new species of animal was found. A type of giant sea worm. The 'inner worm'. They, I believe, came from Hell itself.
I hope you dont believe what I say just do as Hg said, and believe what you want to believe and hope for the best. We can always worry about it when we are on the tethers of our life anyway. So for now just eat drink and be merry and take every day as it comes.
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Post by Hyp3r grunt on Sept 3, 2006 19:29:18 GMT
I don't believe that such a thing like hell could really exist. The concept of hell is there to scare people into doing what religion thinks is right, it is really easy to overcome these fears and realize just why the concept of hell was created. To scare people and to keep them under your control, to keep them enslaved and superstitious. Basically religion says 'If you do something I don't approve of then you're going to suffer after your death, because we really don't know what happens after death I'm just going to tell you that there is ultimate torture for displeasing me.' Yeah, like that's going to happen, just because the religion's leaders (I don't mean 'god', I mean the actual people who wear the mask of an imaginary, all-powerful figure called god to make people follow their religion) want to keep the religion going because it in their favor doesn't mean that people suffer after death for not doing their best to keep the religion going to please it's leaders.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 4, 2006 9:14:14 GMT
Well its possible that hell could exist but you could be right and that the pope really is lying. But the people who 'made it up' as you say, died 1000's of years ago so the people who knew it was a lie are no longer here so no-one knows its a lie. Explain that one
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Post by Hyp3r grunt on Sept 4, 2006 21:29:53 GMT
The information as to hell being a lie has been passed on through probably millions of different sources, it's probably even accidentally embedded within the religion itself that hell couldn't exist, they probably slipped up at some point and made it obvious that hell couldn't exist. I'll need to analyze the bible at some point, if I do, there could be two results.
The first is that when I look deeper into it I see further into how wrong it is and how well put together it is as a method of brainwashing. The second outcome is that I accidentally brainwash myself and become a Christian, which I won't let happen hopefully, but I don't know if I will be able to hold it off, it includes concepts that are pleasing to the human mind and even if you don't think they are real deep down you want to believe in them because they are such pleasant concepts.
You want to believe that the world isn't the terrible place that it really is and that's partly what Christianity does do you, makes you overlook bad things rather than facing them and leaves you hoping for a miracle that won't come and if it does, to you it's a miracle and to everyone else it's an ordinary logical outcome that happens to be in your favor.
The concept of hell itself pretty much explains that it's not all truth, if any. It's not that hard to see that. You just need to think and if you follow any other religion you will have to agree it is a lie because it doesn't work with what you believe. I have no religion and don't believe anything that shows itself as having a purpose which perfectly suits itself to the criteria for the concept they were looking for, big coincidence? I mean, hell is what they say it is, none of it can actually be proved right or wrong and that's the idea behind it, they are free to make it whatever they want it to be. Next time I start a massive religion and give it a mysterious past I'm going to create a place where you are tortured by trees, after all you can't actually prove me wrong and I can only say it is right by force. People believe in hell because they are forced to.
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Post by purpleorange on Sept 4, 2006 22:17:39 GMT
they only believe in hell because what other options are there? Nothing is a very bleak view and, basically people cannot accept the fact that there is nothing left after they die. And if people didn't have the view of heaven and hell, (or anything really), people would have ended up with no morals whatsoever.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 5, 2006 7:14:40 GMT
Well I heard a story of a man (a fairly mordern man) who could bring back the dead moments after they had died. And when one man came back he grabbed the life giver by the collar and screamed 'They're after me! Dont let me go back!' and several other rants. After they calmed him down he said he acctually was falling into the pits of hell and was burning up. The life giver said afterwards that 'The look on his face was so filled with fear that he couldnt be telling lies.'
Well thats it in brief. So does that mean hell exists or maybe its just some crazy man in a dream? Also Heaven, I think, was created as a place to 'keep' God in but if only God existed then why would there be so much evil in the world? So they created a Devil that was locked away in Hell. Then the idea of being brought together with God again came to. And suddenly people could go to heaven, but you cant have prizes with out a booby prize. So you could go to hell as well.
But the whole idea now seems farfetched if said like that. If said my way hell is a possible place. Whether you go there is another matter. I believe in scientific reasons and actual things. Not some crack pot idea that an almighty God surrounds us.
What would you believe? Adam and Eve? or Evolution?
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Post by purpleorange on Sept 5, 2006 7:45:10 GMT
Adam and eve to me is a really ludicrous concept...............it just seems really wrong, its like if someone tells you " i saw three dinosaurs today"...................it just doesnt sound right......
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Post by fluffymonkey on Sept 5, 2006 14:22:38 GMT
what like: I made a time machine and bought you a dodo bird.
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Post by purpleorange on Sept 5, 2006 15:01:49 GMT
yes like that
(and did you that was very nice of you)
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 5, 2006 16:15:04 GMT
Some of the Old Testament bible stories are ludicrus! E.g. Adam and Eve, Noahs ark, etc. Its there just for little kids to 'witness' gods power or to explain things people dont understand.
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Post by fluffymonkey on Sept 6, 2006 18:42:38 GMT
more like just to keep little kids entertained.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 6, 2006 19:07:12 GMT
Exactly!
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Post by dungbeetlesrock on Sept 7, 2006 19:13:26 GMT
finally, hg, someone i can have an intelligent conversation with. there HAS to be something that created us. the universe cant just appear on its own. it wouldnt work. some say it evolved, but from what? every theory of how the universe was created cant work except that someone/thing made it. any1 have any ideas about some atheist/scientific idea about how the universe was made. i can prove it wrong.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 8, 2006 14:51:43 GMT
My thoughts are that there was a big bang. If god created that then its fair enough, but scientists dont work on possible make believe, they would have covered all the angles.
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Post by Hyp3r grunt on Sept 13, 2006 19:23:27 GMT
You really shouldn't have named this thread 'The Truth in the Bible and/or other Religions'. There is none, it's all lies, all of it. The people who made up the religions are only human and they know nothing more than humanity knows so they had to resort to making up false concepts about reality. We know they're false because none of them seem to work well enough to define reality. For example, say God did create everything then who created God? If the universe has a creator then God must have one too.
It's evident that the universe and everything can exist without the assistance of some kind of force. That's quite scary, things don't need creators, they simply 'exist' for unknown reasons. Say the big bang did create everything, where did the big bang come from? If nothing existed before it then how did it simply happen? And if something did happen before it to trigger the big bang where did that come from? Don't say God because that's an ignorant answer that we know can't be right because God needs a creator too.
This thread should really be called 'Perception of Reality'. Reality is only what we make it, nothing exists, there was no creator because nothing has been created. It only exists because something perceives it, I don't say 'we' because something has to perceive us as existing in it. I have no idea what imagines every thing's existence and I don't really want to know. Because I'm only human and if something explained it to me it would be way to much for me to ever understand. Humanity likes simple concepts like 'Gods' and 'Big Bangs', even though they don't exactly explain anything. Just like Halo 2 it raises more questions than it answers and unlike Halo 2 we're never going to get the answers to all those questions. We're only human, I say that again, HUMAN.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 14, 2006 7:11:10 GMT
Who creates lightning Hg? Who creates rain? Nothing. But its there. It creates itself. Big Bang, I'll assume, was created like lighting. Except to a bigger scale. Two massive forces separated to create another force in the form of an explosion. Thats how the Big Bang came to, so I would imagine. But you cant sit there Hg and deny all existence. What is this some big dream? That everyone is dreaming at the same time and interacts with each other? No.
And yes somethings are too complecated for some humans, thats why we dont know everything. But we try. And like you said Halo 2 raises more questions than answers. But Halo 3 is round the corner and wil explain it all. So I can only assume it'll be the same here in life.
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Post by Hyp3r grunt on Sept 14, 2006 16:58:02 GMT
I can easily say that nothing exists but the thoughts that originate from somewhere. I wouldn't class it as a dream, a dream is something that humans have. The human dream is like a dream in a dream in a dream in a dream in a dream and so on for ever. We can define these stages of dreams as reality because there is nothing else. There is no more than one of whatever defines all existence, just a vast one. So vast that all the thoughts can't interact with each other and end up being split up into sections.
Every human doesn't have an individual mind, it's all one big collection of thoughts that covers every human's mind but they don't interact with each other directly for some reason. This creates every human's individual mind because they can't be one with another section of thoughts, it might not be because every thought ever conceived is too big but maybe because all knowledge doesn't choose to be a part of each other, some do though and those are the generalized concepts that all humans recognize.
I would believe that there are infinite other realities that we can't visit because we don't have permission by the massive thought generator that defines everything we humans know and everything that we don't know to visit other sections of thoughts. Other universes. Not on the map with this universe so to speak but elsewhere, we can't access it using this universe. This insignificant section of all thoughts probably makes up less than 0.0000000000001% of all existence.
Then again, we can't really know the truth so you can just go back to pretending that there are gods and big bangs and other creation theories. Just DON'T under any condition say that this is how everything was created because your always wrong regardless of which view you're using. The most important rule: We can't know so if you're making a theory about the creation of everything you will always be wrong anyway, feel free to believe in it as long as you know that that definitely under no circumstances is it the truth.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 15, 2006 7:06:22 GMT
Who is the person who controls the 'big brain' then? God? No of course not you denied him. But then is that man/woman part of an even bigger brain? Then why dont we get a brain to play with and restrict?
And I cant believe you said whatever way we decide to look at creation its wrong? Nobody knows that yet! So how could you? And earlier in this topic you said be open and dont resrict yourself to one belief. But now your telling us that all other belief are completely wrong no-matter what, but your thoughts are right?
How is that Hg? Isn't that contradictory in terms? If yes re-think what you've said and start again. I'll listen. But if no, re-explain it to me see if I understand 2nd time round....
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Post by Hyp3r grunt on Sept 15, 2006 19:26:51 GMT
I still think all creation theories are wrong under the conditions that they can't be proved right but they can be proved wrong. My theory was wrong and every other theory that any human comes up will be wrong until we can know the truth, which is unfortunately never. The human race will die out way before we find out how everything was created. There is no true 'good' and 'evil', no superior force judges your actions, only other things that have consciences and your own conscience.
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Post by Tiger Tyrant on Sept 16, 2006 11:20:34 GMT
I agree with you about the good evil crap but what you say about the creation is a bit wrong. We 'might' be right but really we'll never know whether we are or not. Thats a fact we'll NEVER know.
Humans will probably die out the same way as the dinosaurs, beacuse they ruled the earth but where are they now? Bottom of the loch ness? No thats a myth I wont even take that in here. But whether it'll be the Ice Age (there should be one soon) or a meatorite (I think one is on its way Im not sure) all I know is apocalypse is before the end of the world (I've forgotten the name for that). And we'll let the new 'smarter' rulers of the earth come and take over.
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